Congrats! You’ve made contact with that new lead. What happens next can make or break whether that lead becomes a lifetime client. How and when you engage with prospects is vitally important to every real estate business. So, too, is managing your lead pipeline and having systems in place to keep everyone accountable for following up.
In this week’s Walkthrough, Isacc Guzman returns to continue walking you through the details of the Daniel Beer Team’s follow-up system — a system that helped them do more than $300M in volume in 2020 and earn HomeLight Elite status. This is part two of a two-part series.
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Links and Show Notes
(SPEAKER: Matt McGee, Host)
Every once in a while you will hit the proverbial jackpot. You’ll get a new lead from your IDX website or maybe from a Facebook ad, you’ll call or text, maybe send an email as your first follow-up, and something magical happens. The lead gets back to you after one contact and you become their agent.
[sound: trumpet fanfare]
But most times, this is how it goes. New lead comes in, you call or text, maybe send an email.
Ouch. All right. Later that day, maybe the next day, you follow up again.
Okay then. Well, undaunted, you give it another try.
And on and on it goes until you give up. I saw a stat, I don’t recall the source, but it said 44% of salespeople give up after one follow-up attempt. One attempt! I sure hope they weren’t surveying real estate agents, right? I remember Tom Ferry shared a stat, I think it was on his blog a couple of years ago. And the stat was something like, two-thirds of real estate conversions happen after at least eight follow-ups.
So, good thing we’re in the middle of a two-part series on that exact topic. Isacc Guzman is back with me this week. He is walking us through the follow-up system that helped the Daniel Beer Team in San Diego become HomeLight Elite agents. The top 1% of agents on our platform.
The masterclass in follow-up continues right now. This is “The Walkthrough.”
Hello, hello. My name’s Matt McGee. I’m the editor of HomeLight’s Agent Resource Center. Welcome to “The Walkthrough.” This is a weekly podcast. We have new episodes that come out every Monday to help you get your week off to a good start. This is the show where you learn what’s working right now from the best real estate agents and industry experts in the country.
At HomeLight, we believe in real estate agents, we’re on a journey to find out how great agents grow their business, stand out from the crowd, and become irreplaceable. If you want to get involved in the show or just get in touch with me, you can find me in our Facebook listener community. Go to Facebook, search HomeLight Walkthrough, and that group will come right up. You’ll find me in there. You can leave a voicemail or send me a text. The number is 415-322-3328. Or you can send an email, it’s walkthrough [at] homelight.com.
Following up with leads, the most successful agents and teams are great at it. And when I say great, I don’t mean they convert all their leads or anything close to it, no one does that. What I mean is, they have well-defined systems in place. They’re persistent, hopefully in a not annoying way. And they’re patient because most leads won’t become clients right away.
Isacc Guzman knows that all too well. He’s the head of agent growth for the Daniel Beer Team. They are HomeLight Elite agents based in San Diego. Isacc is in charge of everything that happens from the moment a lead comes in until there’s a purchase or listing agreement signed. They average about 200 leads a week and they did $336 million in volume last year.
Last week, Isacc walked us through the 7-day, 25-touch system that they use with new leads. The ones that they haven’t spoken with yet. He said the Beer team is really big on sending video text to new leads as soon as possible.
Isacc: My crappy video will outperform your non-existent one all day long. Because you won’t do one if the production standard has to be high. You’re not gonna do that. So, I’m just going to do it and there’s going to be kids in the background, there’s gonna dogs barking, I’m going to have stuff in my teeth, my hair is going to be messed up, I’m going to like stutter, and who cares? Like, no one cares.
Matt: So, that’s a taste of part one from last week. Be sure to go back and listen to that if you haven’t heard that episode already.
In part two today, Isacc is going to share the follow-up system for after they make contact with a new lead. You’re going to hear about how they set up temperature buckets: hot, nurture, watch, etc. How they handle pipeline management. And maybe most importantly, the importance of accountability and making sure agents are staying true to the follow-up system.
As I said last week, you might want to have a pen handy so you can take down some notes, jot down some ideas. When part one ended, Isacc and I had just finished talking about their 7-day, 25-touch blitz and the importance of speed to lead. So, now, let’s continue with part two.
Matt: Talk about how you customize your buckets for buyers and sellers. I think you mentioned that if it’s a buyer lead, you are automatically putting them on an auto-notify system?
Isacc: If I have enough information to create a drip for you, I’m going to create a saved search for you.
Matt: And just start sending out emails once a day as they happen? What’s the frequency?
Isacc: So, our ISAs are trained really well on this. And I’ll give you like some general guidelines. If it’s a market where it’s really hot and people are losing out on properties…and our ISAs don’t know all of that, right? But if it’s near a major highway or freeway within San Diego County, you can bet that people were like buying those houses before anybody even like thinks, right? Like, head-spinningly quickly, as they become available, new listing alert. If it’s somewhere that’s a little bit further out, maybe more rural, right? Or at a price point that like doesn’t produce a lot of results, right? Then it’s weekly or as it becomes available. So, there’s like kind of these different things. But yeah, that’s kinda what we do. We’re not like too crazy about it. Unless, again, it’s a really hot market. It’s as things become available.
Matt: Which in the current market that we’re in that’s, I would assume, what you’re doing?
Matt: What about on the seller side? What do your sellers get once they’re through that 7 to 10-day thing, you have contact with them, but they’re not quite ready, what does the communication look like?
Isacc: So, it’s, again, that video update from Dan, it is then a market update for their neighborhood based on their zip code that’s just generated by our CRM. They’ll also get like special offers throughout the year depending on what special offers we’re doing. So, we have like a book funnel. We have webinars. We have all those different things. So, they’ll also get invites to those seller-specific events or offers. But if we didn’t do any of those, it would just be the monthly update from Dan, whatever that looks like. And then their market update every month.
Matt: You guys use heat statuses, hot leads, warm leads. Tell me what that looks like.
Isacc: Yeah. We use hot. If you’re going to pop in the next 30 days, you’re hot. If you’re going to pop in the next 30 to 180 days, you are a nurture. If you’re going to pop in 180 to 365 days, you are a watch. And if you’re 365 days or more, you’re a year-plus.
Matt: Let’s start with the hots. What rules do you have in place for communicating with those people?
Isacc: Minimum of every seven days.
Matt: At least one communication?
Isacc: Realistically, we do more, but that’s a minimum.
Matt: And that is up to the agent to decide what that communication is, when it happens, what it says?
Isacc: Yes. Kind of.
Matt: Okay. Tell me more about that.
Isacc: So, right now it is, we have a description of how it’s supposed to work and we have some automated pieces to it. But yeah, at a minimum, it’s a call every single week. And then they get an email for roughly the first four weeks that they’re in that status. Because if they’re really hot, they should only be in that status for 30 days, right? So, whether they use us or somebody else, if that timeline’s realistic, they should be in escrow in 30 days, right? Now, realistically in our market, unless you have a bag of cash, you’re probably like, from the moment you decide you’re going to buy a house to the moment you actually open, escrow’s probably closer to like four months, even if you wanted to buy a house day one just because of looking and all that stuff, right? And figuring out about the market and slamming your head against the wall a couple of times. So, you’re getting some automated emails once a week for the first four weeks while you’re in there. You’re also getting a call every single week. And then you’re getting a text twice a week.
Matt: Let me ask you this because, again, as I said, my wife’s an agent and here’s one place where I think the system that I frankly installed for her falls apart is using the CRM. The CRM, it will send these automated communications until the person replies. And then once the person replies and there’s human-to-human contact, then the automation stops, which is fine. The problem is, then the human-to-human communication doesn’t always happen as frequently as it should. Am I hearing you right that you’re doing both the human-to-human and the automation at the same time?
Matt: You are? Okay.
Isacc: This is where your listeners are not going to like get a ton of value. We use Salesforce. And Salesforce combined with the other systems that we use, it’s like complete…it’s like playing with a different set of cards. What I mean by that is, when I interact with you, I have just…like, okay, so, for example, a person responds, the rules that you set up in the CRM is that when the person responds, then the campaign ends, right? Well, in our system, the person responds and then I can set a sub-campaign from that. And you could probably pull that off in any CRM, it’s just kind of easier in Salesforce. And again, actually, you know what? It might not even be a Salesforce thing, it might just be, like, we have somebody named Laura on our team who’s amazing and does things like that, and she’s just cool.
Matt: Yeah. It sounds like something that you could do with the right amount of tasks and, you know, drip campaigns, whatever it might be. That, okay, once the contact then shift them over to here, but it’s gotta be done in, I would assume in…I know in our CRM — Cari uses Follow Up Boss — it would have to be done. There’s a couple of steps that a human would have to be involved and say, “All right. Now we’re going to switch them over to this other…”
Isacc: So, there is a point though where that happens to us, too. And so, it is very much set up on the…it is very much on the human, right? But again, if you have workflows that pull in tasking, right? So, I just spoke to you, which means your auto campaign is done. And when I’m done speaking to you, I’m required to set a task. Then I open up my CRM and my CRM says, “You have to do these tasks today. Here’s your workflow for today.” And it pulls in anything that’s today plus overdue. Well, then I’m forced to do that.
But here’s the problem with most agents, they just don’t do what their CRM tells them to do, even if they had that thing set up, right? So, that’s why when you hear like, oh, like our ISA team does that because our ISA team sits locked and loaded all day long doing that. They don’t do showings. They’re not doing anything else. That’s their job all day long, right? So it creates an advantage in that like, if you could be two people, you would be the person who always does the tasks and be the person who’s super responsive to your clients.
Matt: That’s the number one pain point when I talk to agents and people in ops is not making the task list, but actually getting the agents to do what’s on the task list.
Isacc: Yeah. And we have that same problem, right? Now, we have a solution for it, and that’s a whole different thing, which is, once it goes into the agent world, we have a set standard of how many people-ish you should have in your pipeline and what their statuses should be. And whenever you’re outside of those guidelines, be it like you’re past due for follow-ups or you have too many people in your pipeline, we have a pipeline director who says, “This person’s out of order.” Then they get some kind of messaging from myself saying, “You need to revisit that and I need you to figure out what’s going on here.” And then they’ve learned because if they don’t do that, then their lead flow shortens up or stops. They learn to just kick people out of their database that they shouldn’t be having in their database. That gets kicked over to the ISA team. Again, they’re the task machines, by the way, they’re not machines, they’re amazing people. They’re like cornerstone of our business. It gets kicked back into their world. Once the person reconnects and wants to talk or meet again or the timeline is more accurate or is closer, I guess, the horizon is closer, then they kick it back to the agent.
Matt: I wanna ask you more about the pipeline managing in just a minute, but let’s finish because we were talking about the hot, the nurture, the watch, the year-plus. So, let’s finish that off and then get into pipeline management. So, we talked about the contacts with the hot leads. What does contact with nurture, watch, year-plus… You were saying, if I recall, that’s just the monthly videos, is that what it is?
Isacc: So, when they dump into that, what you’re talking about the monthly things, that is pond. Pond is only reserved for people we’ve never actually gotten a hold of. So, contact attempt, contact attempt, contact attempt, seven days, now it’s going to be 10 days, right? After that, you’re put in a pond. I’ve never spoken to you. And so, you’re going to get just monthly updates, right? With the hope that you respond someday. If I’ve spoken to you, you’re a completely different animal because I know you’re a real person and I’ve given you a heat. If you’re hot, every 7 days, if you’re a nurture, every 14 days, if you’re a watch, every 30 days, if you’re a year-plus, every 110 days.
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Matt: We’ve gone really deep so far on the Beer Team’s follow-up system. Let me do a quick little recap here just to make sure we’re still on the same page. Isacc explained that they use temperature buckets to classify all the leads that they’ve spoken to. Hot leads are people who are buying or selling within 30 days. Nurture is people who are buying or selling from 30 to 180 days out. Watch is for anyone planning to do something between 180 and 365 days. And then the last bucket, year-plus, that’s exactly what it sounds like. So, they have four groups for classifying the people that they’ve spoken to.
Isacc also shared exactly how they communicate with those groups. For example, with hot leads, the people who are ready right now, he said they get an automated email once a week, a call once a week, and then two texts per week. He also said those automated contacts happen at the same time as the person-to-person contacts. The people in the other buckets, nurture, watch, and year-plus, they also get regular follow-up, but those contacts are much less frequent than the hot leads, which totally makes sense.
So, that’s what the immediate follow-up looks like once they’ve made contact with a new lead. Let’s get back to the conversation. I have just asked Isacc to share more about accountability in their follow-up system, how they manage the lead pipeline.
Isacc: If their pipeline is out of policy or their pipeline hits a certain amount of people, so those are the two triggers. So, what I mean by out of policy is, Matt, if you have a person, and realistically, we look at it based on the size of their pipeline, right? So, if you have six people, it’s different than if you have 15 people, okay? So, here’s what I mean. Matt, if you have a pipeline of six people, and that’s why there’s a person that does this, right? They use their discretion. Matt, you have a pipeline of six people and one of them is hot and there’s been no contact attempts in the last seven days, you’re out of compliance. You’re getting pulled over, right? Now, if you have a pipeline of 15 and you have one, I’m not going to sweat it.
Matt: Right. Not the end of the world.
Isacc: You’re just a human. I couldn’t pull that off, I know that, right? I have like four. But if you had four, then you’re getting pulled over, right? Or if something’s like really far out, like you have a hot lead and it’s been 32 days, that’s like, “Okay, what’s going on here?” And chances are, Matt, you just need a friendly reminder to go in and either add notes because you have been texting back and forth with that person or you’re like, “You know what? That person’s been ghosting me. I’m just going to close them and send them back to the ISA world.”
Matt: And when they are out of policy, what happens?
Isacc: They get paused on whatever leads they’re getting. So, we have an allocation of appointments they get every month from the ISA. It’s a rough allocation, but we hardly ever miss it. And then also lead flows that come in, like direct connects from Zillow or whatever it might be.
Matt: Okay. So they get out of the lead flow and then you have meetings to sort of help them, help figure out what’s going on, and what can be done to get them back in policy, I assume?
Matt: Let me ask you about a quote. You and I were in a Clubhouse room, this was a couple of weeks ago. And I was taking notes because I loved what you were saying. And I’m going to read this back to you and ask you to expand on this for my listeners.
Isacc: Oh man, you are gonna [inaudible 00:19:17]. Geez.
Matt: Are you ready?
Isacc: You didn’t prepare me for this in the pre-show interview. What’s up? Hit me with it.
Matt: You said, this gets to the being in policy and accountability, you said, “Once an agent books an appointment, we are all over them. What happened? What was the result? What happens next?” Tell me what that’s like.
Isacc: So, there’s status and stage in our world. Status is their heat. I mean, hot, nurture, watch, year-plus. That is indiscriminate of how you feel about the person by the way. It’s strictly timeline-based, okay? Because I don’t want you to jade somebody or elevate somebody just because you may or may not have liked them, okay? “Okay. I feel really good about Matt. Yeah, he’s 90 days out, but I feel really good about him. He’s a hot lead.” Like, no, he’s not. You’d still feel really good about him but he’s still a nurture. Chill out. Stage is where are you at in the process, right? And as we all know, that’s irrelevant of timeframe, right? I could have an appointment set with you. I can have an appointment held, meaning I held the appointment. I can have a signed agreement with you. I could be showing you. I could be writing offers with you. I can be pending, and we could have closed, right? And so, in each of these stages, we have expectations. And not really once you get to showing. Once you get to showing, you’re at the mercy of the market, right? Also, when you get to writing, you’re kind of at the mercy of the market. But at that point, it’s a coaching moment more than it is oversight moment.
But in appointment set…oh, and then we also have appointment reschedule, sorry, because not everybody shows up. Some people have to reschedule. Once it goes from lead to appointment set, like within an hour after that appointment is supposed to be had and note if, like it pulls up in one of our lists. So, that appointment was supposed to happen at 1:40 … or at 12:00 today. It’s now 1:00 today, I’m notified of it. Nothing’s wrong, by the way, I don’t need to know or anything like that, but I know about it, right? So, the person who’s looking at pipeline then goes and says, “If there’s not a note within 24 hours, I’m pulling you over.” And I’m not pulling you over in a bad way on this one, I’m just simply chattering you inside the record and saying, what happened? Can you please let me know? And if you don’t respond within 48 hours to that, you run the risk of losing that opportunity it being redirected to somebody else, or your lead flow turned off, or both. Same thing with appointment reschedule. Appointment reschedule shouldn’t be an appointment reschedule for more than about 72 hours until…like, things happen. You went out of town, the dog got sick, you have to reschedule. But within three days, you should at least be able to reschedule an appointment.
And here’s what I’m saying, like, I don’t expect you to be perfect, Matt. I don’t expect you to be able to rebook the appointment if the person’s a flake. I just expect you to hold it accountable. If within 72 hours you haven’t set an appointment, dude, are you really gonna get that appointment? Like just close it. Get it out of your pipeline, we got plenty of lead flow coming. Don’t hog it. Don’t jam up your own system. Don’t stress about it. Pass it over to the ISAs. If anybody’s going to convert it back to an appointment, it’s them, because it’s their job to do that. You focus on the big picture, right? So, it’s not like a slap on the hand type of thing, so much as it is a, “Matt, if you’re really busy, I don’t want to pass more leads to you. It’s just going to overwhelm you, right?” And also, “Matt, if they’re not responding, kick them out. Let me get you more leads. Let me get you more opportunities, right?” So, it’s not a punitive thing. I know I sound like it is, right? But in reality, I’m just explaining the rules. But the way that we actually treat the people is very like, “Hey, I got you paused. Like, let me know when you’re ready to unpause.” And honestly, it’s a gentle nudge to say, clean up your pipeline. Or I’d say 25% of the time the person is like, “Thank God.” You know, one out of four, one out of three, they’re like, “Dude, thank you so much for pausing me. I was in the weeds. I didn’t really realize it. I’ll let you know when I’m caught up and you can turn me back on.”
Matt: For listeners who maybe have smaller teams though, it might be somewhat eye-opening that, even for a larger team with all the systems you have, that this is still a problem, that you have to have people that are nudging in an encouraging way as you said, nudging the agents, “Hey, we need to know what happened with this appointment. We need to know what happened with your phone calls.” And that you have people dedicated to making sure agents are updating their notes in the database, right?
Isacc: Yeah. I don’t think you can ever get away from that. It’s just a part of running the show, right? And helping. It’s a part of doing the right thing by the agent.
Matt: We have a few listener questions that I’d like to get to before we run out of time if we can. Keenan Gottschall is an agent in the Detroit area if I recall correctly. And I told him that I was going to be talking to you and he said to ask Isacc, “Do you have a workflow for closed clients that’s focused on helping get referrals from them?” He said, “My brain had always called a review the finish line. We’ve never had a system in place that pushes for referrals.”
Isacc: Yeah. So, we do. So the way that it works is, when a closing happens, we obviously ask for the review. We also ask for a survey. So we send out a survey. And based on their survey response, we will tag them in our system. Now, our system, all we simply do is keep them as part of our database nurture program. So, it’s really not something fancy. Again, we’re just following up with them. Every quarter you make a call, they’re getting the monthly updates. Now, think about it. If they bought with us, why would they not then get a monthly market update for their neighborhood? Yeah, they’re probably not going to turn around and sell this next month, but who doesn’t want to know that? Like, when I bought…like, okay, I’m crazy. I get it. So, like, take that into account. I watch what happens in my neighborhood every single month. I look at the update, right? For my house. I don’t ever intend on selling it. I plan on giving it to my kids, but I still want to know. It’s kinda like a video game, right? It’s just like you’re gonna pay attention to that stuff. So, yeah. We follow up there. And we invite them to client appreciation events.
Now, I guess the workflow is like, once you gave me a survey score, you teach me how to treat you. If you give me a bad survey score, you’re not getting me…you give me a bad survey score, you’re going to get a phone call. We’re going to see what we could do to make it better. And then if we figure out like, okay, this is somebody that, you know, something that was out of our control, something that we can make up, something that a phone call or a visit from Dan would help out, right? And get that back on track and get into that 9, 10 zone, then we’ll do that. But if they’re just like, “I don’t like you guys. Don’t ever talk, blah, blah, blah.” Then you’re not part of that workflow, right? And so, I guess the word workflow is just like, very, like… I don’t know. Ours isn’t like as workflowey so much as it’s like, yeah, you’re put on a system where you get market updates for your home. And if you sold your home and for whatever reason, you didn’t buy with us, then you’re just going to get the monthly videos from Dan, right? And then invites to our client appreciation events that happen quarterly. Then you’re also going to get a phone call every single quarter from someone in our ISA department.
Matt: Just checking in, saying hello, seeing how things are going?
Isacc: Checking in, saying hello, how are things going? Heard any rumors, right? You know we work by referral. All the same stuff like you go in Clubhouse, you’ll find 75 people that’ll tell you how amazing they are at doing that phone call. We do the exact same thing. I don’t think we do it any better than anybody else. We just do it probably more consistently than anybody else.
Matt: Which is the perfect segue to how I want to wrap this up because, again, from our listener Facebook community, this is the question that I asked today. I said, “What’s the hardest thing about creating and executing a follow-up system?” The most common replies, discipline and consistency. You want to talk about that?
Isacc: What people don’t realize is that there is a lever in consistency. And the lever in consistency is accountability. The reason you’re not consistent at something or I’m not consistent at something is because I chose not to have somebody help me stay accountable In that particular area. I refuse to lean into accountability for that particular type of item and/or I have some really crappy, low-level, unthreatening level of accountability. It’s all there is to it, right? Like, so here’s a couple of forms of accountability. Accountability partners, sure. A coach, better. Spending a lot of money on something that if it doesn’t work you’d feel like an idiot, it’s a great accountability partner, right? And so, a lot of reasons we don’t spend money on things that we could spend money on is because we’re like, “I probably won’t do it. And then if I don’t do it, I’m going to feel stupid.” That’s actually the reason you should do it. So, the number one lever in pulling any of this stuff off is consistency, but the number one lever inside of consistency is accountability.
(Speaker: Matt McGee, Host)
Consistency and accountability, perfect way to end. Whether you have 36 agents on your team like Isacc does, whether you have a couple hundred agents, or if you’re a solo agent, whatever it is, you have to be consistent with your follow-up and you have to keep yourself or your team accountable. Great stuff, Isacc. Thank you so much.
Let’s do our takeaways segment. This is what stood out to me from today’s conversation.
Takeaway number one, once they make contact with a new lead, the Beer team uses temperature buckets to dictate their follow-up. Here’s how it works. Hot leads are people who are buying or selling within 30 days. These people get at least one call, one email, and two texts every week. Nurture is people who are buying or selling in 30 to 180 days. They get at least one communication every 14 days. Watch is the third bucket. That’s for anyone planning to do something between 180 and 365 days. They get at least one contact every 30 days. And then year-plus, exactly what it sounds like. These people get at least one contact every 110 days. And Isacc made a really important point here. He said, the buckets are strictly timeline-based. No matter how much you like a lead, they’re not hot if they’re three months or six months out.
Takeaway number two, pipeline management is a really, really important part of the follow-up system. The Beer team has standards for how many leads should be in an agent’s pipeline and what their statuses should be. They don’t want an agent to have too many hot leads or too few. So, they really actively manage that to make sure agents aren’t overloaded. Make sure they’re hitting all of those follow-up tasks and so forth. If an agent goes out of policy, as Isacc said, their lead flow stops and everyone works to get back on track.
Takeaway number three, to that point, accountability is the key to a successful follow-up system. You just heard Isacc at the very end, he said, consistency is the number one lever in making your follow-up work. And accountability is the number one lever to create consistency.
One more little nugget, I won’t count this as a takeaway or anything, but a light bulb went off over my head when Isacc said this, it was right at the start of today’s conversation. He said, as long as they have enough info to make it work, they put all of their buyer leads on an auto-notify system. So, maybe something to think about in your business if you’re not already doing that.
All right. Questions or feedback about today’s episode or part one last week, you can leave a voicemail or send me a text, it’s 415-322-3328, you can send an email, it’s walkthrough [at] homelight.com, or find me in our Facebook listener community. Just go to Facebook, do a search for HomeLight Walkthrough and the group should come right up.
That’s all for this week. Thanks so much to Isacc Guzman for joining me. Thank you for listening. Hey, if you get a minute, could you do me a little favor? Would you mind rating and reviewing “The Walkthrough” on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen? I would really, really appreciate that. And when you’re there, be sure to hit that subscribe button so that you get all of our future shows automatically.
My name is Matt McGee, and you’ve been listening to “The Walkthrough.” At HomeLight, we believe in real estate agents. We’re on a journey to find out how great agents grow their business, stand out from the crowd, and become irreplaceable.
Go out and safely sell some homes. I will talk to you again next week. Bye-bye.
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